>> john: throughout the whole process the prosecution's star witness admitted time and time again today that he lied under oath in many situations from being deposed, from being in front of congress, all kinds of opportunities where he was facing legal jeopardy and lied under oath. all of that laid out by todd blanche in great detail. also making it vary clear that 1 of his deepest hopes is to see the former president locked up. >> we'll be under the presumption that there's justice for all of us what cent me to prison needs to turn around and sent to the -- send this guy as

well. >> john: >> martha: the former president calling the case scam and a sham and saying he didn't commit any crime. >> this was a case that was not going to be done and when i announced i was running it could've been done 7 years ago. they wanted it smack right in the middle of an election. >> martha: the underlying misdemeanours exceeded the statute of limitations your ago to the form -- years ago to the former presidents point. that's how he got here despite the fact the ftc and doj looked at all of this and never brought any charges but here we are. more on the day in court today in just a second but first let's go to the courthouse with liddy you. hello lydia.

>> hey martha. that's right the cross-examination really scorching by todd blanche on michael cohen and still ongoing behind me. todd blanche pulling out the themes that are undermining -- undermining his credibility. calling him a liar, a perjurer, also motives of money ends seeking vengeance because he was angry about not being brought into trump's inner circle at the white house. but martha i have to tell you about a stunning moment this afternoon when todd blanche's cross-examination michael cohen edit key moment on direct examination of the prosecution cohen testified he had a brief phone call lasting 1 minute and 36 seconds with keith schiller which is trump's bodyguard. cohen said it happened late 2016 and that he called him specifically to reach donald trump because he new that he would be with his bodyguard. cohen said he was speaking with both of them and told them on the phone call that the stormy daniels deal was done.

that's an important moment because it was the evidence, circumstantial evidence that perhaps trump knew of the stormy daniels deal in progress. and what happened this afternoon on cross-examination, todd blanche who is donald trump lawyer used text messages to show leading up to the call, michael cohen had been receiving harassing text messages from some 14-year-old boy or girl and colin texted keith schiller the bodyguard to ask if they could speak about these harassing calls. the records show they then had a call, 1 minute and 362nd call. because it was so brief, the suggestion on cross-examination is that cohen is at worse lying about the call and they still got these harassing text messages he received from some 14-year-old or at best the interpretation is that maybe they spoke about both, be harassing text messages he was

receiving and the stormy daniels deal but it's still bad because the information about the harassing text messages didn't come out on direct examination lead into this appearance that cohen is perhaps hiding information. the prosecution not bringing forth the entire picture. when you realize and the jury is sent back to deliberate and they realize this entire case is strung together with information that relies on the veracity of what he is telling you, what makes the jury question can we believe michael cullen is telling us the truth or giving us the full picture i really critical. they are wondering if they can trust michael cohen at all. i want to go back inside and give you the latest. >> martha: thank you very much. lydia laid that out beautifully. in terms of what is going on. what is -- wise this keith

schiller call -- we didn't hear about it this morning, they went back to it this afternoon. it so important. >> this call is extremely important because michael cullen testified under oath and under penalty of perjury, we know he doesn't take it seriously given his history, he called keith schiller to speak with donald trump to speak about the stormy daniels case. it appears now from text messages and call logs, when you put them together, schiller actually told michael cole and to call him because michael cohen had been complaining about a 14-year-old who had been harassing him. he didn't know what to do he said could schiller stop it. so what schiller does is he said call me. so he called him and apparently they had this conversation about the 14 euro. those text messages were not given, they were not shown on direct. i don't know if they were even

given to the defence. but if a witness went in knowing he would testify that this is a 1 minute 362nd phone call i had and it was about donald trump and stormy daniels, the text messages at the same time they are talking about this 14 role, it could be this subordination of perjury if they indeed did not give this and hand over these text messages. because it's expository. >> martha: it makes it seem like the prosecution is easing back call the sadist is the call where trump was made aware that cohen had paid stormy daniels and said, okay it's done it's all set. and because they aren't giving the context of the text messages that swirled right around that phone call, they are denying the discovery of what was really going on at that time. but it could be that they talked about it for 20 seconds than

switched over to stormy daniels. >> but that's interpreting a little more than you have 2 because within seconds schiller says call me. let's assume he talks to him about, cohen talks to schiller. he then has to say let me talk to the boss. schiller has to say let me find out if the boss is available to talk to you, let me find out where he is. you know how much time lapses between a discussion about a 14 no kid and finding out of the bosses around, does he have time to talk. i mean it's incredible. the fact these text messages were not brought out and apparently cohen didn't have them either means they didn't give it to cohen and they were trying to hide something or maybe it's just a mess up. this is when my sources in the jury room or the courtroom tell me that the jurors looked at each other stunned. >> martha: that's a big moment. because so much of this hinges

on trump's knowledge of it. but even if he had knowledge of it, so what we so even if, suppose for a moment out was the content of the call, it would still not constitute breaking the law because an nda was decided and agreed upon by 2 adult parties. >> and andy as we all know now it's a settlement, entered into all the time, not 1 person has had donald trump anywhere near the bookkeeping, internal ledgers of the trump organization. and you could even argue if it's going to the attorney it is a legal expense but no 1 can prove what donald trump's intent was. michael cohen himself said, you know, i kind dinner on my own, my wife would be devastated. so where did he get that from? he doesn't have a relationship with her. everything in the case helps the former president of the united

states. >> martha: i thought they also did a good job this morning of or training -- portraying todd blanche and michael cohen as desperate to get back into the good graces of the former president. denying the job at the white house, you know, thought maybe he could be attorney general or chief of staff and he said that's not what i wanted i wanted a higher paying job in that. and i guess the jury can decide what they think about that. but there were a couple pieces of a podcast play this morning where he sounds like an absolute lunatic. he screaming and yelling about how he wants donald trump to pay and suffer like he did. this 1 is back from october 2020 just to give you a sense of what he was saying on his podcast himself. you can decide what his status yourself. >> i truly [ bleep ] this man ends up in prison. they won't bring back the year

are lost or damaged onto my family, but revenge is a dish best served cold. you better believe i want this man to go down and locked inside for what he did to me and my family. >> martha: the reason they played all this as you will know is to sort of establish when he said personally he was willing to lie about things. and then saying you want him to go to jail now too don't you? in other words you are under oath but it would mean a lot to you. you would be happy if he goes to jail. explain you're thoughts. >> obviously, what you have is a guy who is angry. inc. without it. if he thinks he is donald trump's fixer and all of a sudden he goes to the white house and not even asked to be part of it and we also heard he couldn't get tickets to the inauguration. michael cohen's daughter said they're walking all over you or whatever the quote was. you have a guy who lies when it benefits him and now he is lying

out of revenge and out of his feeling that because he wanted jail donald trump should. here's the bottom line, you went to jail because he purged yourself and cheated on your taxes. did donald trump tell you to cheat on your taxes to? did he tell you to do all the bad things you've done in your life? so i think you've got a guy who is emotionally broken. he knows this is the end for him, he's got no law license, no career, nothing. unless donald trump is convicted that he can write out as the guy, i convicted donald trump khaki loses everything. and that's why he is so desperate now. i thank the jury is saying that if you lied to congress and lied to the court khaki is contradicting himself now, then you have robert costello added to this. you think oh my gosh he was going to kill himself. coughs -- costello kept saying to me a favour what do you have on trump, don't kill yourself. this is a bad witness. michael cohen as a linchpin of

the prosecution's case. and he is a broken human being who is not credible. to be as a matter of law and what the judge should instruct is if you believe someone lied about you on 1 fact that you can assume and disregard his whole testimony. >> martha: i'll tell you 1 thing before we go, i was looking at the jury and they are very good at deadpan. they're not giving away in any way how they are interpreting cohen or all of this. they walk in and out of the courtroom as you saw, they beeline for the door, they aren't looking at the former president or michael cohen. very tough to read any sort of emotion from them at this. some of them taking notes diligently and others i thank a bit bored at times. that happens of course. effect to keep the jury's attention all the time and build the story. whether that's happening we will sea. judge, thank you so much. always good to have you.

thank you very much see you soon see you on the pod. former cohen advisor robert costello throwing cold water on michael cohen's testimony. he says cohen swore repeatedly that he had nothing incriminating against donald trump. >> i kept going back and suggesting to him listen, michael, if you have something truthful on donald trump, now is the time to cooperate. and he kept saying over and over again, 10 or 20 times, i swear to god bob i don't have anything on donald chuck. >> martha: but we'll the jury ever hears what robert costello is saying? that's 1 of the big questions. call leaffilter today. and never clean out clogged gutters again.

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>> breaking moments ago the house judiciary committee voting to hold attorney general merrick garland in contempt of congress after president biden executive privilege on his own interview and audio recording with the special counsel. you're member that interview was the basis for her writing that biden was "an elderly man with a poor memory". so the president had not audio and took executive privilege on that. already released the actual transcript. more to come on that. >> speaker mike johnson said president biden is apparently afraid to hear his interview with the special counsel robert hearn. how was the white house responding? >> the transcript are already out there, they've been out there. >> if it's arty otherwise it different to have the audio? >> like i said there are determinations the president made at the request of the attorney general. we took that very seriously.

>> martha: so, we are waiting to hear from former president donald trump as his lawyer questions his former attorney and so-called fixer cohen. also waiting to see if the trump team puts his former legal adviser on the stand, robert costello says the prosecution's star witness could have flipped years ago when he was okay suicidal and desperate to stay out of jail". but costello said cohen said he has nothing, you didn't have anything to turn on his recently former boss, then president donald trump. watch this. >> kept going back and suggesting to him suggesting michael if you have something truthful on donald trump now is the time to cooperate and he could sing over and over 10 to 20 times i swear to god bob i don't have anything on donald trump he also said more times

than that answer, guys i want you to understand i will do whatever the f i will do. i will never spend a day in jail and then he would slant -- slam his hand on the conference table. while he did go to jail. and who do you think he blames for that? >> martha: a lot of drama. let's bring in sunday night in america host trey cody and former committee chairman trey good to have you. this is really getting to the end here. you've got this cross examination of the star witness happening and the prosecution has really hung all of this on michael cohen. now you have this other individual robert costello has a lot of central information to the concert -- conversations about cohen who is put -- piping up. we don't know if you will get called as the expert witness here but he is saying he has crucial information about his

motivation and calling telling him he had nothing on donald trump. how do you take this tray? >> if he thinks it's true it's an extraordinary development for 2 reasons, number 1 at the actual legal innocence. if michael cohen really said that it's actual legal innocence and that doesn't have to prove he or she is innocent but it never hurts if they do. the other thing is, it is 20 prior inconsistent statements about michael cohen, 20 different times? i think costello said that quoting him, i said i swear to god. it sounds a lot like the ill he took. and in a courtroom. so, 20 different times he quote swore to god that trump did nothing wrong. and martha i was a prosecutor for a long time, i have a lot of

really bad star witnesses and i don't like biber had 1 with as much baggage as michael cohen has. to be a convicted perjurer, to listen to the tape, that is the tape i mean he quoted the count of montecristo about revenge you can hear in his voice or he is a pecuniary interest in seeing donald trump go to jail khaki is made a lot of money off of it. so he hates the target of his testimony. he's going to get rich off of it. he has a motive for revenge and they're what 50 prior inconsistent statements? would you believe michael cohen beyond a reasonable doubt if he told you something to buy this stock, if you told you any piece of information, would you believe him beyond a reasonable doubt? >> martha: yeah, but you are and in new york city courtroom. as i said i was trying to read the faces and body language of these jurors, they're not giving much away. they're taking it all in, they look bored sometimes.

it's completely understandable put michael cohen is up there saying now i never wanted a white house job, you know, i know i was lying then but now i'm telling the truth. i'm a different person now. it all depends on how this is falling on that jury tray -- jury, tray. >> reporter: i spend a lot of time staring at the blank phases of jurors and honestly might not want to know what they're thinking. it may not be what you think they ought to be thinking. we have no way of knowing how jurors make up their minds. but i will tell you this there is not a single 1 of the 12 they may find there are other corroborating evidence that michael cohen's testimony is irrelevant. i don't think they will but they may. how would you like to be a prosecutor in your case depending on someone who is a convicted perjurer and hates the target of the investigation and has sworn to get revenge, making money off of it and by the way, wants to see him in prison.

not just convicted martha, wants to see him incarcerated. >> martha: nothing would make him happier. he'd be gleeful. tray, always good to have a peer thank you for making time i look forward to seeing you monday night. thank user. >> yes-men thank you. >> martha: jonathan turley joins me now, a law professor and fox news contributor. obviously folks at home you just saw the former president go back inside the courtroom. they are putting in final hour and a half or so for today. gentleman i want to start by playing the soundbite from this morning on america's newsroom when robert costello joined dana and bill. he was talking about how he testified before the grand jury on this case and he was trying to give them what he saw as exculpatory information about the president, former president trump. he said they kept sort of trying to shut him up when he was doing

that. he doesn't know if they ever really saw the documents and information he wanted them to know. here's what he said, will have you're thought on the other side of it please. >> i told him all of the exculpatory material that i had, that they were supposed to pork before the grand jury, but when i peered before the grand jury those questions they were asking me were not going to elicit the exculpatory information that i had. so i began to expand upon my answers and the da's office was trying to show me down saying i finished my answer. >> martha: what do you make of that jonathan? >> while it's vary strange because the grand jury has much more relaxed rules of evidence. anything can come in, it's 1 of the reasons why defence counsel including myself tended not to have our clients go into jet -- grand jury rooms you don't even have counsel. it sort of the wild wild west. for prosecutors to cut off a

witness to try to keep information from the grand jury is quite telling and says a lot about what we're seeing seeing in this case. costello is a powerful witness obviously. he is the deputy chief of the criminal division at the southern district of new york and has got the chops. he is a major player in the new york legal seen. he was shocked and i don't play him. >> martha: you know, what does it tell you because there is a lot of speculation that this is the crescendo. what blanche is working towards today with cohen is to establish that cohen had motive, that he hated former president donald trump, and costello says he didn't have anything on him and said he would do anything not to go to jail. so those 2 things put together costello said he was telling me the truth when he said he had

nothing untrue -- trump. he claimed he put the story together in order to make it sound like trump was part of this whole thing. but would he be doing interviews and going out there if he is the expert witness they are about to call, jonathan? >> he wouldn't be an expert witness he would be a fact witness. so unless they change what they've been saying to the court about who they might call i don't think they would be calling costello as an expert witness. they're more likely to call an expert witness in federal election violations or bookkeeping issues like is denoting something as a legal expense. that's more likely the subject matter. costello is a wildcard and i have to say as a criminal defence attorney and might be in the minority among our experts. i tend to be risk-averse if i think i want to case, i don't go any further. i don't like to run a risk.

costello is not a risk in 1 sense, a seasoned lawyer, but there is still a risk they are. you could bring in his communications with giuliani telling him this is a back channel that he wanted to use. that's going to create a new dimension -- i don't think they have made the elements of the crime. i think this is dead on arrival. even if the jury issues a verdict, it would be overturned i would hope and a nanosecond because there is no crime that's been established. >> martha: that's a really interesting angle on costello and what might happen on cross-examination for him. you can bet the prosecution is working to get ready for that possibility. he has been a bit cagey about whether or not we expect an. thank you for clarifying he would be a fact witness not an expert witness. jonathan, thank you very much. always good to see you. >> thank you martha. >> martha: so, former president donald trump locked in a dead heat with his 2024 rival

joe biden. as he is standing trial here in new york tribe -- new york. i've got the panel coming up to stick around we will be back. >> trump convicted in the case? >> i think there are 2 solid cases peer generally sixth and georgia. everything else doesn't make sense. every thing else doesn't make sense

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this isn't justice this is politics. it's political warfare and we see it happening in third world countries all over the world. i never thought i would see it happening in the united states of america. >> martha: former president donald trump's largest show of support from republican allies or court today yet doing some talking for him outside the courtroom as the trial gets back underway for the final part of today's session downtown in new york. our new fox polling shows that trump leading over biden only slightly hacked down to a 1 point advantage in the latest poll. i would say that's within the margin of error. let's bring in conway, president of casey consulting and fox news contributor. hugh hewitt who just spoke with former president donald trump the other day and robert wolf former economic adviser founder and ceo of 32 advisors and fox news contributor. great to have you all. i want to put this up first,

another part of the pole that goes to intensity on each side of the aisle. biden's supporters 51% say my vote is for my candidate. 48% say it is against the opponent. trump supporters, 71% for my candidate and 29% only against his opponent. kelly in anhui and on the poles for us. >> sure. national polls are important because they show us mood and trend lines and the lay of the land. i hate the stat you just show it it's incredibly important and not just -- not so different from what clinton was doing when trump on the first time. meaning if you're campaign and voters happen to thank this is really about the other guy, that's perilous territory because elections are about the future not the past and it's about you telling me what you can do to improve my life not just tub at the other guy is. i feel when you look at the

disapproval rating of joe biden on the core issues like his handling of hamas and the economy, their answer to that still seems to be trump, trump and more trump. he has to be more affirmative. the swing state polls are incredibly important. this election will come down to between 19 and 22 counties not even states. counties. there you do see some movement toward the former president. if i were the former president i would look at a couple things and improve upon them improve upon them. 1 among those who say trump is better on had the economy and immigration roughly 10 to 12% still want to go for biden. among the so-called double haters, 15% of the fox news poll biden slightly leading right now. and finally among those who softly disapprove of biden, 41% he is still doing well enough. so i think there is still room for both of them. last point, what happens if

donald trump's convicted, we are asking a different question, what happens if he is acquitted or has a direct verdict? then i think he is unstoppable. >> martha: and we just heard it's likely to be overturned on appeal and jonathan turley said it could happen quickly. hugh hewitt, you're take on what's sort of the next catalyst in this. we do see very tight national polls and when you look at the likely voters versus registered voters in the swing states, those get very tight as well. >> i listen to kelly and when it comes to polling and i have for more than 2 decades because she's the expert but i'll tell you what i thought was interesting yesterday, president biden doesn't want the debate but he has to debate. president trump wants to debate so he eagerly accepted the debate. i think what we saw yesterday was president biden looking at the members and consulting with his team and panicking especially about the new york

times book coming out of nevada that showed trump 12 points, 12 points. >> martha: and he won nevada, biden did last time. >> i think it means latinos are rather significantly -- rather significant. in the debate could be in freefall. >> martha: robert wolf you're take? >> obviously hugh is as great as kelly and i would disagree with them on a few things. with respect to the excitement around president biden. when you see the stock market at an all-time high and when you see a lot of republicans call in for recession but instead we append growth outperform president trump. when you see unemployment and lows of the job market just on fire than when you see things like in wisconsin with the new ai plant with microsoft or in arizona with the new chips plant

with intel i would say that these polls really don't show where this country is going and i'm very excited about the direction we have been more important the avid say 30 polls had biden up in michigan and other states and lastly i think as kelly and knows because she is the professional, i think democrats have outperformed on ballot initiatives and elections by 6 talk to he points whether it is kentucky, kansas, ohio, wisconsin, pennsylvania. and those aren't all blue states. i think we still have 6 months to go. >> martha: it's interesting, we saw that for a while kelly and, it feels like there is a bit of a momentum shift since we saw this à la initiatives but we haven't seen anyone really oppose since then. i'm interested in these stories about minnesota potentially being in play. we always focus on the same states. virginia and minnesota there are

some other places. this could get very interesting. >> no question that. in fact it's only donald trump talking about expanding it out. there was a murmur a few weeks ago about biden being able to complete toast compete in florida because the abortion initiative. no 1 thinks that is true, that state is solid red. and their 3 states that obama carried toys that are now solid red. we have an -- i wouldn't be surprised if the biden people pull out their and try to make it more competitive. i would as the democrats politely name the state reap and expand you're map, where can you expand? >> martha: i want to get a point back from you on that because you are looking at some of these states and shifts that we see in nevada. dew you think we are going to see a different dynamic in 5 months? >> absolutely.

the former president also brought that up yesterday. i think new hampshire is in play , it went to joe biden or years ago. even virginia. i go back to these debates, i think former president trump excels one-on-one if and only if the moderators don't throw curveball often -- curveball set him all day. >> martha: and kelly and i need a quick answer. >> i wish it were fox news. i think when you reward people who spend their entire days calling you a liar and wood prefer to see you in jail that's questionable but i do think everything that's been said about the debate -- debate availability is important. it's a sweet spot for donald trump and i'm happy to see him debate.

i think democracy deserves at, we deserve an opportunity to deceive these -- see these people shoulder to shoulder free of charge. >> martha: and sodalite. that would be great. thank you both. and to thank you. the former president donald trump's defence thorough a curveball at this trial. 1 of his attorneys on what the defence we'll do when they get rolling back next. say goodbye gush fears! thanks to always ultra thins... with rapiddry technology... that absorbs two times faster. hellooo clean and comfortable. always. fear no gush. okay everyone, our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy. yay - woo hoo! ensure, with 27 vitamins and minerals, nutrients for immune health. and ensure complete with 30 grams of protein. (♪)

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witnesses. robert costello once an advisor of michael cohen said cohen told him trump had 0 involvement in the payoff. michael cohen took it all on himself. costello believes he wanted to do that because he wanted to ingratiate himself to the former president. would he be a good witness? witness -- listen. >> i not been subpoenaed. whether i will be called to testify has not been decided yet. it probably depends a lot on what will happen today in court. >> if you are in todd's shoes would you call you to testify? [ laughter ] >> yes, because i'm a reliable person. >> martha: let's bring in low sharp attorney for the former president art of his advisor team. not specifically involved in this case and also ready for missouri attorney general as a republican. welcome back to the program. tell me how you would break this

down. what are the pros and cons of calling or not calling robert costello but the defence? first of all i think it's important to remember and a criminal case like this the prosecution bears the burden. in this case it bears the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt each and every element of every charge in the indictment. in this case business records fraud. i think based on the trial record thus far they have not come close to meeting their verdict. they've not shown there is any underlying fraud and have not certainly showed these business records were intended to cover up any other crime which they have 2 based on the way they have charged this case. so i think there's a good argument if the prosecution is not met its burden, first of all the fair judge would dismiss the case altogether but if the prosecution's case is as divisive as it is, there's an argument to not put on any more evidence at all. i think ultimately it will be a

decision for the trial team after the final close of the prosecution's case likely at the end of today. but aced on the trial record so far i don't think we need anything more to win this. we will sea how it proceeds in the next day or so. >> martha: here's robert costello talking about another person who a lot of people,'s name has been invoked so much that many people are asking why haven't we heard from alan weisel burke currently serving his second term in prison. watch this. >> we are presuming that weigh some -- weisel burke does not have been the information that would be helpful. if they thought he had awful information they would immunize him and bring to the courthouse and have him testify. the fact that they have been done that leads 1 to reasonably conclude maybe weisel break doesn't have the information that helps in, rather it helps donald jump. >> martha: so, allen was a burg was the ceo of the trump organization for decades.

close to the former president. he has held the line and insisted on the presidents innocence. he is back in jail so extraordinary story. would it be beneficial to have alan there and especially there in an orange jumpsuit most likely? >> we have been heard from him yet but we have heard from other trump organization employees. i think their testimony was incredibly damaging to the da's case. meconium basically testified these expenses were booked as legal retainer payments because that's how essentially every payment to a lawyer and his 30 plus years with the trump organization had been booked. may be the da's just sick of colon trump organization officials up to the stand to cut the heart out of their case. but again the legal deficiencies that the factual deficiencies of

the case are so profound and just bring through with all the witness testimony we've seen so far. i thank the da's office may frankly want to just get this over what. >> may be. thank you and good to see you. i want to remind people, it's going to end at 4:00 today. they are lining up -- wrapping up a line of questioning and may walk out at any moment. jonathan turley standing buy as we await the former president.

uuu, this looks romantic. [bell sounds] welcome, i'm your host, jacob. hi. how was the weather getting up here? fine but, you know, i think we're, we're just going to go up to bed and— do you believe in ghosts? [whistling kettle sound] no? good!

not prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt? still a question about whether the former president decides he will take the stand. he said again today he has done nothing illegal. let's bring in jonathan turley while we wait for him to come up. you're thoughts on what happens next jonathan? >> first of all if the indications are true the cross-examination will continue monday. that's a very good move by the defence. i expressed alarm when the defence suggested they'd be done today because it would allow a long weekend to pass and the

last discussions of michael cohen would be the prosecutions redirect. i don't think that's a good thing. so that's a strong showing buy at the defence to carry this into monday. i think they are scoring points here. blanche is really going methodically through this. you know, there seems to be a low bar for michael cohen that if he wasn't clucking like a chicken or some freak on a leash that it was a successful performance khaki is obviously well rehearsed. i don't think people realize how many of these shots are below the waterline. it doesn't come together until the closing argument when the attorneys bring all of this together. and it's a very bad set of facts for the prosecution. as it was just noted, you have trump officials saying any time we paid an attorney we put it as

a legal expense. it wasn't trump. there is no showing he had any knowledge of the core backed is supporting this entire case. that alone would seem to dam the case. and then everything is riding on a witness bizarrely being caught in the last 2 days that seem hard to square with the truth. and, you know, the jury we'll hear an instruction very likely that if a witness lies in any aspect you have the right to disregard any aspect of the testimony. i don't see how any witness could listen to michael colon and not see a number of glaring errors and possible perjury act that includes the phone call that he said was the key moment when he informed trump that the stormy daniels deal was done. and all indications, that free phone call -- rather brief phone

call was about a 14-year-old harassing michael cohen. >> martha: i want to remind everybody as we await former president donald trump to come out, there is no trial tomorrow. the president did receive the day on to go to his son's graduation from high school. and as he pointed out jonathan the defence has made clear that on monday they're going to continue their cross-examination of michael colon. so the long weekend will have them come back and likely wrap up. any indication and anything you've seen that former president trumbull take the stand? >> i haven't, but it would be an act of lunacy. the judge has already ruled that the prosecution would have this huge scope for cross-examination

if the president takes the stand. that ruling all but doomed any chance trump could take the stand. if i was his lawyer i would say that's it if the judge is going to let any of these, basically this broad scope to go forward, there is no way to prep you and the risk is too high. they have won this case in my view at least legally. i cannot speak for the jury but as i've said before, new yorkers don't like to be treated like chumps. they may hate donald trump, but they hate being played. that's the 1 thing i've noticed about new yorkers. there being played and i have to reset it. >> martha: i have to tell you, in court this morning you just have to love people of new york honestly of the court officers, everybody in that place there just so great and strong at played to everyone honestly. and, you know, they are doing their best to run a safe and

efficient courtroom here. i'm thinking jonathan the instructions that were given or parameters that were given if trump testifies on his own behalf are basically going to allow every single act in the widest scope to be brought into this. that and of itself's potential grounds for appeal right? especially after the weinstein case just got overturned on similar grounds. >> rate. we've some new levels of reversible error that i don't know what the court would ultimately base it on because this judge has committed in my view a successive series of raposo bull errors. 1 of which was to allow the prosecutors to keep referring to election violations, leaving the impression that donald trump committed election fraud or campaign violations. that is not true. but, i would think that these jurors probably think it is true.

but there are a lot of reversible errors. the only problem for the president in my view is not the outcome of the child even if he is convicted, i just cannot imagine that this could be upheld. the problem is just time. it will take time to get it to be reversed. the question is do you want to take a further risk to try to take down this case right now? i would caution the defence. you're winning in my view on the law hands down. i wouldn't go rolling the dice too much because you never know when you'll come up with snake eyes. >> martha: jonathan, thank you. so great to have you with us. as we watch all of this unfold. taught blanche is wrapping up for today is questions for michael cohen and we wait for the former president to come up. that is the story for now i'll see you back here tomorrow at 3:00. fox goes on after this. [ ♪♪ ]